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Old 11-08-2012, 03:18 PM   #21
kneedrachen
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Jeez Poolie, you go right for my jugular don't cha?

I really didn't think the Tea Party had the oooomph to make it, only because (IMHO) they're a bit too conservative for your average working class person. Again, not a critique, just an opinion. I understand the desire to minimize government, regulation, etc. I just think they were a bit too hardball in their campaigning an ideology. I did notice as they faded out, Romney started to lean a bit more their way.

I also find it interesting, in my worldly travels, that suspicion and doubt of the government among "First World" countries, seems to be unique to America. Not right, not wrong, not indifferent, just an observation.

Part of me wonders if this is due to the founding of the independent nation, a core, closely guarded tenent is still within our subconsciousness as citizens.



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Old 11-08-2012, 03:28 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by ksr5 View Post
My biggest concern with this election and others is the outright lies that the Media is allowed to put out there about candidates . How is anyone suppose to make an informed decision? people who only get there news from one source and than not verify it tend to believe everything that is said by that source.
The problem here is that many people wish to be told how to think, what to think, how to vote, etc. They are not willing to invest the time to compare records. There are resources out there to make informed decisions but they rely on a willingness and commitment of the voter to make use of them. The media, whether it be newspaper, radio, television, etc. has always been slanted. Thats not a bad thing. It's slanted because people have opinions and agendas and whomever is running a particular news outlet is going to present information to people through that filter.

Our job, as citizens, is to be vested in the process and outcome enough to find the information presented in its most pure form. Such as voting records, speeches and so on just to name a couple. Unfortunately that doesn't happen a lot now and leaves many prone to being swayed.

We used to teach this stuff in school. We used to have textbooks like the Catchetism of the U.S. Constitution, the Lives of the Signers of the Declaration of Indepnedence and so on so we could learn about the documents and the people. Sadly that is not the case anymore. If you ask people something simple like what are our nations organic documents are you are likely to get a response along the lines of "I didnt know we had eco friendly paper then".

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Originally Posted by Buffalo-jon View Post
I have kids and worry for thier future more than my own.
Im trying to stay away from being overly pointed here in the forum because I like sensible, challenging discussions on these kinds of matters. I hate it when people just blatantly reject your ideas or views simply because they disagree with them and then cant even tell you why they think as they do. I make no apologies for being a conservative. That, however, does not default me to the Republican party. In fact I am equally disgusted by both parties.

However, worrying for your kids is well founded. One of the things out there that really bothers me is the U.N Convention on the Rights of the Child. It is already being moved forward for ratification here in the U.S., the only country to not have ratified it. What people seem to miss is that the U.S. Constitution treats treaties as the supreme law of the land and therefore trumps constitutional and state law.

It is scary stuff and I shudder to think what parenting will become like in this country if that treaty is signed.


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Old 11-08-2012, 03:44 PM   #23
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Knee said, "Part of me wonders if this is due to the founding of the independent nation, a core, closely guarded tenent is still within our subconsciousness as citizens."

I certainly hope so. It was distrust o the crown that gave birth to our nation. The goal of the constitution was to ensure that the federal government's power was limited. Something that has been eroding ever since Abe the aggressor waged his war of northern aggression (now that should stir the pudding a bit).
The second amendment was not about being able to hunt or protect my house from criminals. It was about protecting ourselves from an over reaching federal government.
Unfortunately the founders did not realize that subsequent generations would willingly exchange their hard won liberty for perceived security.
Although some saw this coming in the early 1800's...

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.”
― Alexis de Tocqueville

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Old 11-08-2012, 08:12 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Poolie View Post
Everyone reach around and pat themselves on the back. A two page long thread about politics and everyone is still being an adult. That has got to be some sort of internet record :-)
Guess we're all just fighting desperately to hold it in, ready to pop at any moment!

I could also voice some wacky conspiracy theories that I harbor, but I will keep those to myself, lest I hear Black Helicopters in the distance.
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Old 11-08-2012, 09:29 PM   #25
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I can't believe a 30 page thread on EBikes was so much snarkier than a political thread - way to go guys !

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Old 11-08-2012, 09:36 PM   #26
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Its my charisma and loveable personality.

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Old 11-08-2012, 09:46 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StormStrikes
I have been giving some thought to things since last nights election. If you are a Christian, a Conservative, a Constitutionalist or all the above then you probably share my sentiments of disappointment on the election outcome.

However, there are some key points to keep in mind here.

First, we lost a battle, not the war. Its not the first time any of us have been disappointed in election results, no matter where on the political spectrum you fall and I can promise you it will not be the last. That, though, should drive you, encourage you to stay engaged. To continue the fight no matter what it is you see America being. It should motivate you to study our nations founding documents, our nations founding history, its principles and so on. So you have a clear and solid foundation in which to judge the actions and directions of today's government.

That brings me to a second point. We MUST stop this stupid, childish, unproductive divisive bickering. I could care less if you are Democrat, Republican, Conservative or Liberal, we all love our country and love our freedoms and liberties. No matter what your political affiliation is, your loyalty is not to the party, it is to the country. If you have EVER taken an oath of office due to public service or served in the military I challenge ANY of you to find me one instance where it is an oath taken to uphold, protect and defend to the best of your ability, the party line, ideals or goals. Rather it is to the Constitution of the United States.

Lastly, do not be irate or disrespectful of the election outcome. It is not what I wanted nor many others. Yet it is what the people wanted. This nation is great, among many other reasons, because we ALL have a voice. Last night the people spoke. Despite the many groups and voices crying for a change in direction from the path we are on, the American people voted to keep things as they were. The presidency, the Senate, the House of Representatives all remain largely unchanged. While I may not agree with it, and I did voice my dissent with my vote, overall the American people spoke in a louder voice, louder unison than I alone. It is a sacred right of this country and I will respect it, honor it, even if I disagree with it. I urge all of you to do the same.

Respecting and honoring the outcome does not mean you agree with it, nor have given up the desire for change. It does mean we make strides to end this divisiveness. Once we do that then we can unite in one voice, in one purpose and move ahead with our own respect and honor.
Defiantly agree.
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Old 11-08-2012, 10:03 PM   #28
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This is how we want our politicians to act.

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Old 11-08-2012, 10:41 PM   #29
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Interesting story that I just came across -

Seems someone misplaced a bunch of Military ballots that would have changed the election outcome.

Nice move that we overlook/treat the Military in this fashion, after they risk their lives for our freedoms.

My dad/brother are retired Military men, and they are livid now since this story came out.

http://www.duffelblog.com/2012/11/military-absentee-ballots-delivered-one-day-late-would-have-swung-election-for-romney/

LOL - I've been had (along with many others) it would seem. Apparently, duffelblog.com is a military humor site.



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