[pcrx]

I would agree. Recumbents are indeed FAST!

I would invite everyone to take a look at my post here. Watch the embedded video near the end of the post. That was Cycle Oregon 2008, where on that particular downhill I hit my fastest to date of 54 MPH. There is an image in that video taken by a Cycle Oregon photographer of me hitting a corner where my speed was 50 MPH. It was scary. Pray for "no sand."

[BlazingPedals]

Loved the video pcrx! Nice shot of the roadies drafting you. I liked the downhill passing scenes, too. Ever notice how many gape, then check their speedometers, then gape some more?

That hand cyclist was pretty amazing doing 17-18 mph!

[pcrx]

Thanks! The hand cyclist was my cousin who had a knee injury. He wasn't about to miss Cycle Oregon!!


I think the topic of "how fast is that thing" is a good one. While its not always about speed, people ask that question a lot. and yes they are fast!

Whoooooooo!

[BlazingPedals]

How 'bout this one?

Racing Recumbents | Living the Dream

The ride was 110 miles, turning race-pace for the last 40. I tried to cause some pain, but the stiff headwind mostly just hurt me. At the end, the ride usually breaks up on the hills, but all attacks and any sense of tactics were negated by a pair of strong old dudes on recumbent bikes. We could barely draft them, but they lacked the acceleration to get away, so they just hammered the front of the ride at a nasty speed, leading to a giant bunch sprint and a lot of complaining at the end. There’s talk of banning them next year. It’s hard to say if that’s fair, but if Graham O’Bree couldn’t get away with it, why should these guys get a pass? What if someone showed up on a motorcycle?

PS: one of those 'old guys' won the sprint, too.

[digitalmouse]

Originally Posted by IanHighfield

Scotty, the 55 miles is with a fairing.

So? Nothing stops uprights from using fairings for speed trials. Maybe they are too unstable to use on uprights? Aww... poor guys... limited by air-friction...

[digitalmouse]

Originally Posted by IanHighfield

The least of their qualities is speed off the line. You've got 2 wheels to get moving in the rear, not one. Plus they weigh a ton and a half.

I can only speak from my own personal experiences with the local bike messengers - who are regular TT and road-racers. If I do my shifting right (I have a 3x8 with the 3 speed as a hub drive, and I'll typically race with the cassette in 2nd and only use the hub shifter - Or i'll just use every other gear), and I've got the energy, I'll beat an upright off the line on a drag race at a stop light at least 50% of the time.

These are younger guys (often close to half my age) on lightweight racing DFs, and I'm on my Anthrotech (AnthroTech Trike), a ~24 kg (52 lbs) tadpole trike (single rear wheel).

And yes they seriously race me, just to see what I, a marginally fit 42 year old, can do on a heavy trike. At least once a month I'll ask someone if they want to race to the next light, and they gladly take me up on the offer.

Even if I lose, they are still impressed that I can keep close on their tail in a 400-500m sprint. Of course after that I drop back due to asthma and legs conditioned for 10-12 hour tours, not sprints.

I have a colleague at Pedalkraft.dk that alternates between a Brompton folding bike (set up for racing), and a Steintrike Nomad (tadpole lowracer). He can trounce DFs not only off the line, but against the regular training DF packs we have running around Copenhagen - on either the trike or the Brompton. Admittedly he has at least double my output wattage, if not more.

So while there isn't much "official" documentation on the fact, it has happened before that 'bent trikes (without fairings) can beat DFs, when the conditions are right. Just comes down to the fitness of the riders.

[pcrx]

It is true that a tadpole trike will out accelerate most bikes in a sprint off the line. The instant speed when in a trike is a great feeling!

[PaulW]

The short and accurate answer is that the fastest are as fast as a high end diamond frame time trial bike like the FELT DA. The slowest are slower than a heavy MTB. What you get from a really fast recumbent is DF TT bike speed with comfort. What you get from all recumbents is comfort with trikes being the ultimate in relaxed riding but not ultimate speed.

There are very few really fast recumbents and even fewer that can climb well and AFAIK none that climb as well as a light DF.

The 'best' recumbents like the Carbent, Metaphysic, M5, John M's MBB, Cruzbike Vendetta and Bacchetta Aero (add your own!) are fast and comfortable. The rest are just comfortable.

Because recumbent owners are usually older, comparing the overall performance of recumbents with DF bikes ridden by relatively young riders isn't valid. Neither is it valid to compare the average speed of a paceline of DFs with the speed of a solo 'bent rider. A paceline adds 4-6 kph to a riders average speed.

Unfortunately, recumbents have been sold on the implied basis of free speed due to the better aerodynamics. Then prospective owners may be told that what they lose on the climbs they'll gain back on the descents. They won't.

There is also the issue of the different speed characteristics. These characteristics make bents in a paceline of DFs a problem. On any descent a good recumbent will break free at about 50 kph and nothing catches it except a Cat DF racer using a cadence of ten squillion. So you either run ahead of the pack, or brake. On the flats, the bent rider is using very little energy compared to the DFs. Coming into a climb, the pack of DFs is usually an obstruction as the (experienced) bent rider enters the hill fast. The (good) recumbent performs equally to around 6% gradient, then drops off the back.

As a recumbent rider, I know that if I want to beat the strong DF riders to the cafe, I have to play on the recumbents strength because I AM riding a TT bike and they're not! Riding along in a pack won't do it.

So I have to gap the DFs sufficiently that they can't catch me on the last climb before the cafe. Because I ride a very good bent, the Metaphysic, I lose very little on the shorter hills. It's hard for a solo DF rider to match the recumbent on the flat unless there's a tail wind (a tail wind negates some aero.) I have not met a solo DF rider of my fitness (ie oldish fart) that can match the speed of the recumbent on ANY down grade, starting at 1%.

My technique is to surge where I have the advantage and hold where I don't. If I pass a solo DF rider on the flat at 45-50 kph (and I can briefly hold that speed) the shock and awe discourages most riders from trying to match me even though my average speed may only be 1-2 kph faster.

I've owned some ten or more recumbents and only three were what I'd consider fast. I do love my bent but years of experience have educated me to the reality that too many recumbent designs are not efficient. My recumbent makes me faster than I'd be on a DF. I've tried both. For short town journeys, I much prefer the single speed DF to any recumbent. For chasing roadies, my Metaphysic, Fulcrum Racing 3, Vittoria Corsa EVO CX, FSA ceramic compact is an effective tool, limited only by the rider.

[lowracer1]

Originally Posted by PaulW

The short and accurate answer is that the fastest are as fast as a high end diamond frame time trial bike like the FELT DA. The slowest are slower than a heavy MTB. What you get from a really fast recumbent is DF TT bike speed with comfort. What you get from all recumbents is comfort with trikes being the ultimate in relaxed riding but not ultimate speed.

There are very few really fast recumbents and even fewer that can climb well and AFAIK none that climb as well as a light DF.

The 'best' recumbents like the Carbent, Metaphysic, M5, John M's MBB, Cruzbike Vendetta and Bacchetta Aero (add your own!) are fast and comfortable. The rest are just comfortable.

Because recumbent owners are usually older, comparing the overall performance of recumbents with DF bikes ridden by relatively young riders isn't valid. Neither is it valid to compare the average speed of a paceline of DFs with the speed of a solo 'bent rider. A paceline adds 4-6 kph to a riders average speed.

Unfortunately, recumbents have been sold on the implied basis of free speed due to the better aerodynamics. Then prospective owners may be told that what they lose on the climbs they'll gain back on the descents. They won't.

There is also the issue of the different speed characteristics. These characteristics make bents in a paceline of DFs a problem. On any descent a good recumbent will break free at about 50 kph and nothing catches it except a Cat DF racer using a cadence of ten squillion. So you either run ahead of the pack, or brake. On the flats, the bent rider is using very little energy compared to the DFs. Coming into a climb, the pack of DFs is usually an obstruction as the (experienced) bent rider enters the hill fast. The (good) recumbent performs equally to around 6% gradient, then drops off the back.

As a recumbent rider, I know that if I want to beat the strong DF riders to the cafe, I have to play on the recumbents strength because I AM riding a TT bike and they're not! Riding along in a pack won't do it.

So I have to gap the DFs sufficiently that they can't catch me on the last climb before the cafe. Because I ride a very good bent, the Metaphysic, I lose very little on the shorter hills. It's hard for a solo DF rider to match the recumbent on the flat unless there's a tail wind (a tail wind negates some aero.) I have not met a solo DF rider of my fitness (ie oldish fart) that can match the speed of the recumbent on ANY down grade, starting at 1%.

My technique is to surge where I have the advantage and hold where I don't. If I pass a solo DF rider on the flat at 45-50 kph (and I can briefly hold that speed) the shock and awe discourages most riders from trying to match me even though my average speed may only be 1-2 kph faster.

I've owned some ten or more recumbents and only three were what I'd consider fast. I do love my bent but years of experience have educated me to the reality that too many recumbent designs are not efficient. My recumbent makes me faster than I'd be on a DF. I've tried both. For short town journeys, I much prefer the single speed DF to any recumbent. For chasing roadies, my Metaphysic, Fulcrum Racing 3, Vittoria Corsa EVO CX, FSA ceramic compact is an effective tool, limited only by the rider.

wow how many feet of dirt did you have to dig through to find this thread.....? lol