[froze]

Originally Posted by qmsdc15

It costs absolutely nothing to use a bike shop in the manner you recommended to bicyclotic. "Go to a bike shop. Ride everything." (Oh, I see you've removed that from your post...)

I agree with Noel that it is ethically questionable to test ride bikes from the LBS with the intention of buying elsewhere.

Unethical? Perhaps, but what if he rode a several bikes and didn't like anything he rode enough to pull the trigger?

Also you can use fitting guides provided by the online stores, you don't have to ride a bunch of bikes to determine what size of bike you need. So to say (not you another poster) that you can't find a bike online to fit properly is totally absurd. Like I mentioned before, even very expensive custom built bikes are ordered online, and if people spend that kind of money without fear about fit then I think the average rider can buy a production sized bike and not be worried anymore then going to an LBS and buying a production size bike there. Even after buying a production sized bike from an LBS the LBS will push to sell you a pro fitting (unnecessary in my opinion), if you think you need a pro fit you can take an online bike in and do the same thing.

And to say an LBS won't eat is a sob story, they eat just fine, if they couldn't they would be out of business.

EDIT: by the way, people buy cars all the time by test driving cars at various dealers, so according to your rational one should never buy a car from a different dealer after test driving a vehicle from the first dealer.

[qmsdc15]

Originally Posted by froze

Unethical? Perhaps, but what if he rode a several bikes and didn't like anything he rode enough to pull the trigger?

Also you can use fitting guides provided by the online stores, you don't have to ride a bunch of bikes to determine what size of bike you need. So to say (not you another poster) that you can't find a bike online to fit properly is totally absurd. Like I mentioned before, even very expensive custom built bikes are ordered online, and if people spend that kind of money without fear about fit then I think the average rider can buy a production sized bike and not be worried anymore then going to an LBS and buying a production size bike there. Even after buying a production sized bike from an LBS the LBS will push to sell you a pro fitting (unnecessary in my opinion), if you think you need a pro fit you can take an online bike in and do the same thing.

And to say an LBS won't eat is a sob story, they eat just fine, if they couldn't they would be out of business.

EDIT: by the way, people buy cars all the time by test driving cars at various dealers, so according to your rational one should never buy a car from a different dealer after test driving a vehicle from the first dealer.

One should never buy a car. Car drivers are the number one killer of bicyclists.

[froze]

Originally Posted by qmsdc15

One should never buy a car. Car drivers are the number one killer of bicyclists.

And the #1 cause in motorcycle accidents as well.

[Noel]

Ok I guess I am lucky to have such an ethical and quality bike shop nearby ( by nearby I mean about 45 mins. away) My point about manpower costing is that if you take an employee away from productive work, ie. repairs or dealing with customers who actually intend to buy, then it does cost the bike shop money. I think maybe I am taking this a little too personally because I am thinking of my LBS, the owner of which has become a good friend over the years. I know that all shops are not created equal. There are plenty of examples of shops in my area, that I would prefer not to do business with and if given the choice between patronizing them or resorting to online shopping I would probably go with the best deal. The shop I do use would never try to sell me a pro-fit but they do spend a very long time helping to set up my bikes (no extra charge) wether it is when I buy a new one or am just changing my stem. One thing that I know is that a good bike shop is a haven for all who enjoy riding and a valuable resource that needs to be supported. Every new bike I have purchased in my adult life has been from the man who now owns my LBS. He sold me my first new bike when he managed a shop and every bike since I have purchased from the shop he now owns. I have gotten great deals every time and I know that my customer loyalty has paid off, both monetarily, and personally. I have to reiterate that a good shop rewards their regulars with the best service and deals possible so any extra money I might have paid for my bikes has been a worthwhile investment.
I have not investigated all the threads on the forums, so maybe a LBS "jeers and cheers" exists, but if not would anyone be interested? Ok sorry to run on. Anyone know how I could get work as a LBS lobbyist?

[froze]

Noel you use your LBS the same way I use mine. I go to my LBS for various supplies and never bought a bike from them, the same is true with the person buying a bike off the internet, so the LBS is actually going to make more money off of parts and supplies and labor then they will selling you bike anyways. I have no jeers against LBS's...except for one in my town which is unfortunately the largest one but they act like snobby jerks so I no longer do business with them since a new and far more friendlier but smaller LBS came to town.

But again it boils down to the nature of sales. A potential buyer walks onto a car dealers lot, a sales person takes his time to help them while another person enters the lot. The first person looks and looks and test drives a model or two and the other person leaves unattended, meanwhile the first person doesn't buy so he leaves. The sales rep made no money, because the first person left and the other he'll never know if he was was buyer. That's sales, it's true anywhere you go to buy something, TV's, real estate, etc, and even bicycles. It's just the nature of sales, get use to it, the LBS's have.

[qmsdc15]

It's the buyer who goes to a retail venue to try on shoes or bikes or cars with the intent to buy elsewhere who I have trouble with. If you want try bikes at the local shop so you can decide what to order online, you should tell the salesman up front that you would like to test ride his bikes but you have no intention of buying one of them. As long as you're honest and up front about it, I suppose it's OK. Actually I think it stinks, but if you're honest and up front about it, it stinks a little less I guess.

[senecacyclist]

Hahahahahahahaha!

[froze]

Originally Posted by qmsdc15

It's the buyer who goes to a retail venue to try on shoes or bikes or cars with the intent to buy elsewhere who I have trouble with. If you want try bikes at the local shop so you can decide what to order online, you should tell the salesman up front that you would like to test ride his bikes but you have no intention of buying one of them. As long as you're honest and up front about it, I suppose it's OK. Actually I think it stinks, but if you're honest and up front about it, it stinks a little less I guess.

Well people are doing the same thing with cars today. They go to a dealer, find a car they like, negotiate a price but feel they didn't a good enough price so they leave and order the car online for a better price. This is going on all over the place not just bicycles. It's a competitive world, and retail stores are at war with prices on the internet and thus far are losing. There has always been competition, how many stores went out of business because of Walmart? Best Buys is hurting because of internet sales, and people go into Best Buys have the sales rep show them a product and they leave and get it cheaper on the internet. Does that stink? yeah, but that's business. With bicycles though your not going to test ride a Trek for example and say gee I like this but I can get it cheaper on the internet because Trek doesn't sell them that way. So actually LBS's have it better then Best Buys because their bicycles usually can't be had for less on the internet.