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I don't care if it has pedals, or if the pedals turn to power the bike. I don't care if it is half powered by a human and half powered by the motor. Once a motor, of any kind, is put on a bike, even a motor used to assist, it stops being a bicycle and becomes a motorized scooter, moped, motorcycle, etc. But it is no longer a bicycle and should cease to be called as such.

Yes, I'm a purist when it comes down to it. It is either a bicycle or it isn't, there is no half way or in between. And a bicycle does not have any type of electric or gas powered motor of any kind on it what so ever.
 

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Oh and did anyone bother to notice which news web site posted the story? Need I say more about it?

If you're confused as to what I mean, please ask.
 

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"Ford says it has no intention of building the E-Bike just yet, but joins a number of automakers considering similar vehicles while they look to expand their businesses from cars to “mobility” as environmental concerns and rapid urbanization begin to push traditional automobiles further from the mainstream."
 

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I don't care if it has pedals, or if the pedals turn to power the bike. I don't care if it is half powered by a human and half powered by the motor. Once a motor, of any kind, is put on a bike, even a motor used to assist, it stops being a bicycle and becomes a motorized scooter, moped, motorcycle, etc. But it is no longer a bicycle and should cease to be called as such.

Yes, I'm a purist when it comes down to it. It is either a bicycle or it isn't, there is no half way or in between. And a bicycle does not have any type of electric or gas powered motor of any kind on it what so ever.
Settle down Beavis...
 

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I guess if it was MSNBC it would have been fine then.
 

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There are many that don't consider recumbents to be "real bicycles".
Yeah the way he's blowing a sphincter over tradition you'd think he was rocking a penny farthing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Hack I took it to mean the car companies may be seeing that regulations are going to get tougher and tougher and compliance may get tougher and tougher making the product more expensive. In time it could put a car out of the reach of many people that still need to get to work. Providing a more affordable alternative could be a viable way to grow their business, and this was just the research and development. Ford has been in other forms of transportation in the past. Did anyone know that Henry Ford once produced airplanes? The Ford Tri motor was the airplane back in the day, but Henry found out the same thing many others have when getting into the airplane business. The best way to make a small fortune in aviation is to start with a big one. Henry was smart enough to get out before he was broke. Bikes could be the same, or it could be a new profit center.

As far as the slam on Fox, I wish I had a nickel for every time someone said "Fox Lies". When they have made mistakes, they corrected them at once. When asked for a single lie that Fox News has broadcast, seems an example gets hard to find.
 

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If an e-bike means one less car on the road then I'm all for it. The thought of peddling one of those things when the battery runs out makes me cry on the inside though.
 

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Hack I took it to mean the car companies may be seeing that regulations are going to get tougher and tougher and compliance may get tougher and tougher making the product more expensive. In time it could put a car out of the reach of many people that still need to get to work. Providing a more affordable alternative could be a viable way to grow their business, and this was just the research and development. Ford has been in other forms of transportation in the past. Did anyone know that Henry Ford once produced airplanes? The Ford Tri motor was the airplane back in the day, but Henry found out the same thing many others have when getting into the airplane business. The best way to make a small fortune in aviation is to start with a big one. Henry was smart enough to get out before he was broke. Bikes could be the same, or it could be a new profit center.

As far as the slam on Fox, I wish I had a nickel for every time someone said "Fox Lies". When they have made mistakes, they corrected them at once. When asked for a single lie that Fox News has broadcast, seems an example gets hard to find.
A company called Kari Keen once manufactured trunks and accessories for cars and they also produced airplanes too. When car company's started building their products with the trunks and accessories Kari Keen went out of business. It happens.

There was a time in history where it was hard and expensive to afford a car, but not because of the expensive government regulations of today. During that time a lot of people rode bicycles as a result of this. Now it seems things are returning back to that point. How's that saying go? "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

I never said fox news is lying. I had a different point about my comment about them.
 

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Hack I took it to mean the car companies may be seeing that regulations are going to get tougher and tougher and compliance may get tougher and tougher making the product more expensive. In time it could put a car out of the reach of many people that still need to get to work. Providing a more affordable alternative could be a viable way to grow their business, and this was just the research and development. Ford has been in other forms of transportation in the past. Did anyone know that Henry Ford once produced airplanes? The Ford Tri motor was the airplane back in the day, but Henry found out the same thing many others have when getting into the airplane business. The best way to make a small fortune in aviation is to start with a big one. Henry was smart enough to get out before he was broke. Bikes could be the same, or it could be a new profit center.

As far as the slam on Fox, I wish I had a nickel for every time someone said "Fox Lies". When they have made mistakes, they corrected them at once. When asked for a single lie that Fox News has broadcast, seems an example gets hard to find.
I took it as Ford trying to convince the world that they have some technological skill. Electric bicycles seem to have a terrible cost/benefit ratio.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Electric vehicles as a whole are not now and probably never will be ready for prime time. In the early days cars were often electric. Jay Leno had one he drove on TV a while back of that vintage that with the crude batteries of the time managed to get about 100 miles to a charge. The electric cars in the 70s or so, anyone remember the EV 1 and it wasn't any better. Now we have light weight materials, hi tech batteries, cost through the roof and the Volt will only go 40 miles before the engine kicks in and the Leaf I read somewhere might get 100. Now I would like to drive a Tesla but I wouldn't own one. Yet that range number is not too much different than Jay's even after millions of dollars of research.

A bike has a much lighter weight which would make things easier, but the cost vs weight vs speed as you said Hack just isn't there. At the prices I have seen electrics go for with the exception of the Ebikes, you could buy a fairly decent used car and not have most of the limitations.

I suspect this is Fords way to do a small scale test of the technology, learning what works and getting solid data that at some point they might upscale. Batteries are a lot cheaper for a bike than a concept car. Maybe they will find a break through, but I wouldn't hold my breath. Yet anytime I seem to think that something can't be done, someone seems to find a way to do it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
@VR 40 rider Yeah back then cars were incredibly expensive for the time, and unproven, new and the infrastructure for the most part didn't exist. It really wasn't need and society at that time was hardly as mobile as it is today. When people live their entire lives less than 60 miles or so from where they happened to be born, an automobile just doesn't have the same priority. IIRC the quote was "Those that do not learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them." Yet I don't think it applies directly to this situation unless you demobilize the entire society. When Ford came out with the Model T, there wasn't a used car industry and a car had to be such that enough people could afford them and find the value in the product to buy enough of them that the savings of mass production could be realized.

A bike today can offer many possibilities, but it will take a very specific set of conditions to make it a practical primary means of transport. Yet today's auto market is so out of touch with reality as to be headed for a nightmare. I know I won't ever own another GM or Chrysler. That Volt is such a huge seller now and thats with a big taxpayer subsidy. Ford may be playing a game to show the regulators they are researching electric cars spending as little as possible to buy some time till the next election.

You did slam Fox, and with absolutely no reason based on the article link. IF you are going to slam a network, state your opinion and back it up with facts. Discuss the merits or the point, but don't bash the messenger without making your case why. If you want to make it political, that needs to go off list
 

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photos, what do you mean by it will take a very specific set of conditions to make bicycling a practical primary means of transport? Please name some of the conditions required to do so.

I know how a bicycle can easily be a primary means of transportation, but won't say anymore until I see what you have to say on the conditions required to do so.
 

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E-Bikes - silly to me, get a moped if you are too lazy to pedal.
Recumbents - I thought those were designed for the handicapped, I don't get them.

Meriam-Webster defines a Bicycle as a vehicle with two wheels tandem, handlebars for steering, a saddle seat, and pedals by which it is propelled; also : a stationary exercise machine that resembles such a vehicle
 

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Just think what an ebike would do to the average fuel economy of the "fleet"! If you got to meet federal standards for average fuel economy, a few versions of two wheel vehicles would raise the average pretty good! Just stick the blue oval on them and voila!
 

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Just think what an ebike would do to the average fuel economy of the "fleet"! If you got to meet federal standards for average fuel economy, a few versions of two wheel vehicles would raise the average pretty good! Just stick the blue oval on them and voila!
If they got rolled into CAFE, we wouldn't be seeing crappy little Korean cars re-badged as American. And the Big Three would be giving them away.
 
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