Is Grant Peterson right?

Discussion in 'General Bike Discussion' started by fatandslow, Aug 28, 2009.

  1. fatandslow

    fatandslow New Member

    44
    0
    0
    I would like to get some input here. As I understand it, Grant Peterson used to run Bridgestone's American marketing operation (anyone out there please help me if I'm wrong, including you Grant if you happen to be in the neighborhood) and now owns Rivendell Bicycle Works. He advocates (correct me if I'm wrong, don't want to put words in anyone's mouth) steel frames, clearance for much wider tires than the standard 700cx23, and a larger frame size for a given PBH (pubic bone height) than most. To tell you where I stand, I find his arguments very persuasive and his bikes blow my mind, at least from an aesthetic perspective. But... I read his diatribes about clipless pedals etc. and I'm not so sure.... please check out Lugged steel bicycles, wool clothing, and leather saddles from Rivendell Bicycle Works and tell me what you think.
     
  2. Industry_Hack

    Industry_Hack Total noob (& forum admin) Admin Staff Tavern Member

    12,350
    651
    113
    Was there a question in there somewhere?
     

  3. fatandslow

    fatandslow New Member

    44
    0
    0
  4. Industry_Hack

    Industry_Hack Total noob (& forum admin) Admin Staff Tavern Member

    12,350
    651
    113
    Without actually knowing what the argument is, I really can't say whether he's right or not. The tire size issue is moot without knowing the reasoning behind it. Same with the frame size - a larger frame is about more than just seat tube height, it's about top tube length, and therefore, reach.

    I'm curious to know what his beef is with clipless pedals. Even Jock loves them.
     
  5. CTD50

    CTD50 DX's Biggest Member

    793
    0
    0
    There was an editorial a few years ago in Bicycling Magazine by the senior editor, who was a 'client' of Grant's...and said that the bike he was fixed up with was a revelation! It seemed to enhance the editor's ride experience in a new way, don't remember all the details (and I don't think I still have that issue). He did state, however, that it wouldn't turn him away from his 'old' bikes and their 'inefficiencies'.

    Grant Peterson's hate on clipless is one of silliness; he claims that racers are dictating to us what is proper to ride, and that most non-professionals are just going clipless for the fashion of it. I personally would like to take my riding shoes and clip him upside the head for that, because clipless enhances MY riding experience like nothing else! I could lose the gears, lose the suspension, lose the disc brakes, even -- but I will give up my cleats when they pry them from my cold, dead feet! I had to 'take a break' from clipless a couple years ago, due to failure of one of the pedals and my temporary inability to replace it. One week on platforms, and my legs were in full revolt! Cramps that woke me up at night! O heck NO!

    I personally doubt Mr. P could do much for me; I like where I am with the bike.
     
  6. Burr

    Burr Cranking Old Guy

    712
    0
    0
    Narrow and hard tires are fast, what more can you say.

    Clips help so you can pull and push and this saves work.

    I run half inch tires and wish I had 1/4 inch at times. air at or above 120psi. Haven had a flat in years but after saying this I'll have one tomorrow.

    I have ride only clips on my road bike and walk around clips on my touring bike. YUP fill over twice this year at a stop but I ain't to smart and I'm a slow learner (20 years)

    BUT, the biggest thing is to get out there and turn the cranks, pride comes with the ride!!!

    Egg beater and fat tires on my city bike
     
  7. Industry_Hack

    Industry_Hack Total noob (& forum admin) Admin Staff Tavern Member

    12,350
    651
    113
    They'd be slower. Seriously.
     
  8. Burr

    Burr Cranking Old Guy

    712
    0
    0
    Why, remember I am only on paved roads with no traffic.

    I run above 120psi.

    Teach the old man.
     
  9. CTD50

    CTD50 DX's Biggest Member

    793
    0
    0
    where are you getting 1/2-inch tires? that's like 13mm! 19mm is the smallest i've ever heard of, for racers (tubulars), and 22mm is the smallest clincher (regular tire) I've evr encountered. BTW, if you run 120+psi, you're only faster if the pavement is absolutely smooth; you will bounce over irregularities, and bouncing slows you down.
     
  10. Industry_Hack

    Industry_Hack Total noob (& forum admin) Admin Staff Tavern Member

    12,350
    651
    113
  11. Burr

    Burr Cranking Old Guy

    712
    0
    0
    OK, you guys are right and I am wrong about the size.

    I have 700x23 on my road bike 120psi

    touring is 27x1.1/8 120 psi

    city bike 26x1.25 slicks 85psi

    So, I didn't know what I was talking about, looked like half inch to me.
     
  12. Grape Ape

    Grape Ape Younger than Hack Tavern Member

    746
    0
    16
    I sent an email off to him to see if he would come here and expand on his thinking. He sent me an email, in it he said,

    ....I don't want my opinions to be divisive. It's just bike stuff. There are lots of ways to go about it, but it so happens that the general bike media generally presents a racing-centric perspective, where racers are up on a pedestal, and the closer we emulate them, the better off we are (as Unracers). I don't buy that...but I have no quarrel with those who do. I just try to give voice to alternative ways, and for a lotta people, they work well. Nothing's forced, though!.....

    He also included the following link regarding pedals. Rivendell Bicycle Works: The Shoes Ruse

    From my reading of his site and this is my opinion he is just old school plain bicycle, nothing fancy, he doesn't see any reason to buy fancy shoes or pedals. He sees no reason to buy special clothing to ride, he does see the advantage to wearing a jersey on longer rides due to the pocket in them but otherwise says what ever you have in your closet is good to go. The bikes he designs are set up for a ride. The wider width of the forks and rear is to allow for a larger tire or fenders if you want them. His main goal is to get you on the bike. No fancy stuff needed just go out and ride, basically a run what ya brung type theory.
     
  13. Burr

    Burr Cranking Old Guy

    712
    0
    0
    It cost to buy all these fine riding things.

    I have riding shorts so my bottom won't hurt on long rides.
    I have two kinds of biking shoes, one for the road bike and one set for the touring bike so I can ride a little easier.

    I wear a undershirt that I fill very well because of lifting, bike shorts that I fill very good because I got a fat butt and cleat shoes. A heart rate monitor a bottle of frozen Gatorade/half water and a small bottle of water to rinse with when I get to hot or if someone needs it, a tool pack, cell phone and a small first aid kit and away we go I also have ID and my PDA.

    AND A TOWEL TO WIPE SWEAT WHEN I STOP.
     
  14. CTD50

    CTD50 DX's Biggest Member

    793
    0
    0
    GA, I checked out the link you posted about pedals, and it seems I was pretty much right. He puts out as much misinformation as the people he's flaming. It's pretty rare anymore to hear ANYONE outside of a race team talk about 360deg of pedaling force -- I sure don't, but I do put some pull into the upstroke. And as far as his claim of 'more efficient muscle use', that's just not true. If it were, I wouldn't have had cramps in my calves from platform pedals the last time I was on them!

    I'm not hammering on you, you just posted the link; I still have a problem with Peterson's retrogrouch attitude. Have for years.

    For those who have enhanced their riding by using Peterson's methods, I applaud you. For those of you who personally debunk Peterson's methods and continue to ride as you see fit, I applaud you as well. Why? YOU'RE ALL RIDING!

    I usually don't get judgmental about stuff until someone else does in my general direction; in this case, Peterson's "if you like things this way, fine, keep doing it...but you're wrong because of A, B, and C" gets me going enough to say, "Grant, if it works for you, fine, but you're wrong because you're trying to present your way as superior. So STFU."
     
  15. fatandslow

    fatandslow New Member

    44
    0
    0
    Too bad his old-school plain bicycles are so expensive. They are pretty tho. I do certainly agree with Grant on the issue of weight. I think too much emphasis is placed on weight for non-racer recreational riders like me. My hybrid weighed 22 lbs before I started adding crap like rack, bags, stem-raiser, etc.. I don't even know what it weighs now, but I'm sure the amount by which I'm over-weight exceeds the total weight of the bike and accessories. I like my clipless pedals, and don't see myself going back. As for the wool and seersucker vs. lycra thing, me in lycra is a crime against humanity anyway.
     
  16. hophead

    hophead New Member Tavern Member

    1,501
    1
    0
    Thanita at Dirt Rag interviewed Peterson in #129. I tried to find it on their Website, but it doesn't appear to be there.
     
  17. Burr

    Burr Cranking Old Guy

    712
    0
    0
    Got to go ride, it's 6:09am here.

    See you all in a few hours.
     
  18. Burr

    Burr Cranking Old Guy

    712
    0
    0
    Damn it, all this talk about tires and I had my first flat in years today.

    Had to walk a mile bare footed to get back to the pickup.

    It went flat as far from the starting point as it could be.

    Put in a new tube, the other one had been there about 8 years and had grown to the tire. First flat.